I've been looking into Classical Conversations. This was my first exposure to the classical model of education. It appeals to me on many levels, though it's so different from anything else that I've seen. What are your opinions on this style of education?
My friend's son is doing CC, and it's been a blessing for him. He's convinced that he's "dumb" and "can't learn". I think there might be some learning disability or something. This year, someone "donated" him the money for CC, and it's really helped build up his confidence in himself. He comes to my house every Friday morning for Science (he's Phillip's best friend), so she and I talk a lot about what's being done there. Having said all that, Carl and I started reading "The Well-Trained Mind". Both of us felt frustrated with it. By the end of the first chapter, we both felt that she was almost worshipping the human mind and human intellect. I don't know how to explain it in any other way. It really turned us off from Classical education.
I am not sure exactly a lot about it, however, I learned that alot of twhat we are doing this year is to be considered "classical-style".
In theory, I love it. In practice, I call myself "classically eclectic". My kids don't learn things in the same way or in the same order as other kids, so it makes a 100% classical education impossible for us to follow. We have an EXCELLENT classical university model homeschool academy here that I'd love to send my kids to, but for various reasons, I can't. I suspect they'll end up taking a few classes there, but they'll never do the entire curriculum as it's laid out. I have several close friends who follow the classical model and who are very conservative Christians. The classical model is about teaching in a particular style, and not necessarily about following some all-supreme human model. Take what you like, and leave what you don't.
I'm sorry, I know most people who use the Classical approach don't go around worshipping human intellect. But that's just the way it came across in the book. It really turned me off. But there are some aspects of it I think are very good.
It think the classical method will fit some kids well and others not so well. I have incorporated some classical elements into our homeschool this year and my boys have loved it. We added a good chunk of time toward reading literature as well as time appreciating different artists and composers. As with any method of education I would take what works and leave the rest behind.
I've read through the Well Trained Mind and even if you don't subscribe to that method (which is quite rigorous) it has great lists for history, music, art, and literature.
That's us. I follow her basic book lists but do it all my own way. I think whatever method fits you and your family is the method you should choose. And this will be different for everyone because everyone has different personalities.
I know several families who subscribe fully to the Classical method. None of them are happy in that they love the program (moms or kids), though I think they do it because they believe it will be best for education. I would be interested to hear someone write in who really loves this method in order to hear a different viewpoint. I haven't read The Well Trained Mind, but I have read various information from that website and other sources. Though I use parts of the ideas of the Classical method, I don't fully subscribe to it for several reasons. It is relatively new. I am a person who likes to see the data. I don't try brand new drugs which come on the market because I want to wait and see if there will be some kind of side effect discovered after it has been released to the general public which was not known about through the smaller drug trials. I am the same way with homeschooling. I think Classical theory has been around for about 12 years. I would like to see some data about how these kids perform on the SAT and regarding college admissions and performance. Perhaps they will do better than all the rest of the kids, or perhaps not. We don't know yet. I am wary of putting all of my eggs in one basket (of the Classical theory) if I don't have any evidence that it will produce a quality education for my kids. Secondly, I don't subscribe to the belief that the younger kids in the "grammar stage" should be taught mostly with rote memorization. This is the part that my friends and their kids hate the most as it seems to me. I am very much into doing drill, review, and teaching a certain amount of "Core Knowledge" to my kids and to have them memorize some amount of important information (i.e. math facts, geography, important dates and events in history, etc). However, Classical education goes way too far overboard, even for me. I often have very analytical discussions with my second grader about important issues we are encountering in our studies. I don't think we ought to save those discussions for later when he gets into junior high. Another part of Classical I don't agree with is teaching Latin. I don't necessarily believe that learning Latin will help improve vocabulary. Just because they learn a Latin word doesn't mean that my kids will be able to identify the Latin root in an English word they encounter. Also, I don't see why I should teach them Latin so it will be easier for them to learn other languages in the future. If I want my kids to learn German, why don't I just teach them German now? I see my friends' kids memorizing all of the conjugations of certain Latin words, and I just don't think that it will worth the amount of time that they are investing in that. However, if any of you have a different experience or anecdotes of success from teaching Latin, I would be interested in hearing about it. I don't mean to offend anyone. As I said, I would be interested to read a rebuttal from anyone who has had a positive experience with Classical education.
From my own personal experience, I can definitely disagree with all of this. My son started learning Latin when he was 4 (and my little guy is picking up on it, too... none of us have a Latin background, so I'm learning along with them). We started with "Song School Latin" (very fun... made for little ones), and they'll be coming out with a part 2 to that book very soon as well. He's finishing Latin for Children A right now, and let me tell you, HE IS LEARNING how it relates to English and other languages. ABSOLUTELY! He blows me away at how well he can look at a word he's never seen and figure out, more or less, what it might mean in other languages because it has a Latin root in it. He can read children's books in Spanish even though we've never learned Spanish. The roots are the same. He already knows English prefixes and suffixes, because they're the same in Latin (things like pre- or inter- or contra-). We'll also be learning Greek. Theres quite a bit of data out there that proves children who learned Latin in school got, on average, 200 points higher on their SAT scores. That can mean the difference between scholarships and getting into certain schools or majors. That's not to say they were classically taught... just that they learned Latin.
We didn't learn Latin, but I did teach Latin/Greek roots using English from the Roots Up. One day, after a lesson on geometrical shapes in math, Rachae (age 8 at the time) came up to me and said, "OCT must mean EIGHT in Latin or Greek." When questioned as to why she thought so, she told me that she had just learned that an octogon had eight sides, and she knew an octopus had eight arms, so OCT must mean EIGHT. Even now, I'm constantly pointing out the roots when I come across a certain word. Recently, what was it...? OH!!! Mean, mode, and median! Faythe was having trouble keeping them straight. I told her that MEDIAN has MEDI, which means MIDDLE or CENTER (as: MEDI-Terranian Sea....) And it helped her to keep them straight.
Thank you so much for all of your input! What appeals to me is that it seems to be a history and literature-based method of learning. The Latin aspect is foreign to me, but I'm open. I can see how it would provide a backdrop for all kinds of other learning in regards to language in all forms. I'd love to hear more from folks that have used Latin and seen a benefit from it. Jackie, I found the author of "The Well-Trained Mind" to be a bit uppity as well. But then again, I think she truly was just trying to do her very best at what she was doing which is certainly commendable. (Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with all your might!) I'm definitely still in the decision-making stage, so thanks for sharing your thoughts and opinions.
I'm pretty new to Classical education, but we've been at it for over a year now. I've really, really enjoyed it so far. At Peace Hill Press, there are several downloadable classes. I'd really suggest taking a listen to "The Joy of Classical Education", and also the ones on writing. I've followed many of the suggestions in the Well-Trained Mind this year for grade one, and we've had a really enjoyable year. I guess being new at homeschooling, I really liked how well laid out all the suggestions were. As I've gotten my feet under me, I've made modifications to the plan to fit my kiddo and our life. Plenty of fun history projects, and I've enjoyed the focus that is on history, which is usually quite neglected. I've personally learned a lot! As to the rote memorization, I've not found that to be a problem. There is logic in the fact that the younger kiddos like repetition, and this is something that we can take advantage of. There also hasn't been a ton of it. Our time doing memory work in the morning is five minutes at most, and the kids enjoy it. They love reciting poetry for friends, and my ds hasn't even minded memorizing the definitions for parts of speech. Latin... I'm not sure if we'll do that. Not at this point anyways. I need to do my own research to see if that's worth the time and effort.
As far as rote memorization, what do you think nursery rhymes are? And kids memorize them no problem. When I was little, I had HOP ON POP and GREEN EGGS AND HAM pretty down as a preschooler; my kids pretty much had CHICKA-CHICKA-BOOM-BOOM! down. And every Christmas, the kids roll their eyes every time I start with, "Every Who down in Whoville liked Christmas a lot, but the GRINCH, who lived just north of Whoville, DID NOT!!!" I had to memorize it for our Christmas Pagaent when I was in 5th grade, and it was a fairly new story. I can still recite large sections of it! (All this to show that kids WILL memorize rote. They DO memorize rote. So why not GUIDE them in WHAT they memorize?)
I have a very good friend who's finishing up homeschooling her kids (one in college, twins on the way to college, and a younger starting high school). She has her kids memorize entire chapters from the Bible. How? A fill-in-the-blank that starts with only a few missing words, and each day, she removes a few more words. After a week or two, they're able to write the entire chapter by memory. The kids actually LIKE doing this this, too!?! I've been studying the Bible since I was born, but I guarantee her three oldest kids know more than I do (in quotation and in practical application).
Cc My friend's son is doing CC, and it's been a blessing for him. He's convinced that he's "dumb" and "can't learn". I think there might be some learning disability or something. This year, someone "donated" him the money for CC, and it's really helped build up his confidence in himself. He comes to my house every Friday morning for Science (he's Phillip's best friend), so she and I talk a lot about what's being done there.
I totally disagree with this being a new way of educating. This is the way that people were educated for hundreds of years before public school systems were invented. Also, there are differing views on the grammar stage. I love the book Trivium Mastery: The Intersection of Three Roads: How to Give Your Child an Authentic Classical Home Education. There is no reason to completely break it down into three sections of learning. I am planning on doing a classical education with strong Charlotte Mason components. I will teach Latin and grammar. I will give my kids a strong classical foundation. However, I will do science, nature study, history, art, music, etc using living books and a less formal curriculum. I think that the best part about homeschooling is that you can read up on all of these different types of education and then make up your own mind about what works best for your family and what works best for each kid!
I do not know much about classical education. I find some parts appealing, but think I could just supplement material I feel would be beneficial instead of completely changing curriculum or our "system."
