I need help before I drop kick these two dogs out the front door!!!:evil: The two toy shuh tzus we got in August are now 6 months old. You'd think they be house trained by now but oh no. These two feel the need to pee on every surface in my home and I cant stand it! When we got them they were 10 weeks old and had not been trained. I worked and worked with them and little by little they got better. Every once in a while one would pee on the floor, usually in the game room. One dog even started going to the back door and growl when she needs to go out. So what happened?! All of a dang sudden these two are pissing on everything! I just walked into the living room and there was dog piss all over my sofa! Eariler today one peed in front of the front door. Last night they peed in the hall way! I can't stand this! I am super picky about things being clean and this is beyond what my nerves can handle. About a month ago I decided they were to be banned from the game room because anytime one stepped a paw in there they pee or poop so the game room is off limits. period. But what about my living room, kitchen, hallway? I don't want my house to smell like pee and frankly I can't take it. I just can't! Someone help!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Are you using an enzyme cleanser to clean up the pee? If not they are going to continue to pee on your furniture and carpets because they can smell the pee. You need to use a specially formulated enzyme cleaner designed to neutralize urine. Once you've done that it's just a matter of teaching them where to go. Many times with small dogs it's harder to train them because they don't make noticeable motions or sounds when they need to go out. Best way to train them is to put them on a leash and tie it to your belt loops, then set a timer to remind you to take them out every 10 minutes until they go potty, then give them 30 minutes and repeat the every 10 minute thing until they are reliably using the outdoors as their potty. Also it would be helpful to teach them a signal that you will recognize as potty. I've know people who teach their dogs to ring a bell, bark at the door, whine at the door, or just run in circles.
Yes I am using a special cleaner just for dog pee. Not sure what it's called but I got it at walmart. I have done all the "training" just that way too. They were actually fine for a while. I dont' know but they seem to have regressed and I don't know why. I just had a sit down discussion about the dogs with my two girls telling them they have to take more responsibility with them.
They are littermates? Male, female, spayed, castrated? At this point, I would put each of them in a separate crate only big enough for them to stand up and turn around in. They can remain in a crate for a few hours if necessary. As soon as you take the dog out of the crate, take it immediately to the door on leash (the dog needs to physically walk to the door with you in control rather than being carried--and do it one at a time until potty training is finished. They very well could be regressing by feeding off of each others mistakes, which is why they need to be trained individually. Another component could be the introduction of hormones and pack hierarchy which can both bring on dominance marking. This includes marking if they consider you to be in competition with them for position. In that case, you need to reestablish that every human in your home outranks them and you get to decide when and where to deficate. Hope this helps!
I'm also guessing they are coming in puberty, which could be causing problems as well. And my favorite pee-cleaner is 1 cup peroxide, 1 Tblsp of baking soda, 1 tsp of dish liquid. Just check it on a small hidden spot first. Yes, it really does get warm when you are using it lol! It works well.. smells like stale baking soda but that's better than pee. I don't have great advice for housebreaking. My almost-12 yo dog Charlie was housebroken (by me) when he was a pup but in his old age he's not anymore (he's losing his mind I think.. sometimes he's great, other times he'll pee in the middle of the floor). My other dog, Annie, was 5 when I got her and has NEVER been really well housebroken. I love them both.. but I'm looking forward to a few dog free years
Yes they are female littermates and are spayed. Since we got them I crate trained them just like you said only they were in a crate together. I did carry them a lot instead of using the leash which I should have done. But I was very consistent with them taking them out every 30 minutes and then eventually every hour. When they pee on the floor I take them outside immediately, tell them to go potty, take them in and put them in the crate. I have to think it is regression simply because they were doing relatively well only having an accident every once in a while. We do have another dog, Gunner, who is 5 and weighs 65 pounds compared to their 8 pounds. They do "submit" to him so I think when it comes to pack hierarchy they know he is in charge. They will roll over for him, wait for him to walk out the door first, things like that. How do I go about re-establishing that I am in charge with them? Could you give me some ideas? And thank you for your help thus far!
I started this, got distracted, and since there have been other responses, but I will finish with my original thoughts for what it is worth. I just went through (am still going through) the puppy thing. I know our trainer stressed the importance of teaching the dog that you are the dominant figure. I personally would interpret the couch as the dog showing their dominance on your item, especially since they were doing fine before. Now, I am not a dog expert, so someone else can feel free to disagree. I would incorporate you and your girls showing the dogs that you are in charge. If you already do these things great, but I just know these are items we have worked on. Bathroom breaks are done on leash with you giving a command to go potty. Until I started using the leash, my dog would go outside, play, come in and pee. The leash limited distractions and focused on the purpose with the command. Another easy way to show you are the leader of the pack is food time. Water is a freebie, food is yours that you are allowing them to eat. They do not eat until you give the command. You make them sit while you put the food in the dish and pretend to eat it. They are only allowed to eat when you are "done" and give them the ok. There are more if you are interested, but I won't go on if this is already something you know/do. Sometimes it is hard to remember that dogs do not think the same as we do.
Thanks for posting some ideas on establishing your leadership, azhomeschooler. A few other things to prohibit are the dogs from getting on your beds (this is possible later when you have complete control and compliance from them with permission), jumping up to greet people, growling at anyone for any reason, or claiming any possession. Nothing belongs to them; everything belongs to the humans--including food, toys, and especially other humans. If they were previously making progress, but are now regressing, I'd examine what changes in the home, dynamics, routine, etc. took place at the same time. Sometimes the slightest freedom they gain can cause rebellion during puberty. Another factor is your other male dog. Look at his behavior toward them. Is the pups' urination at all associated with his dominance display (which should not be allowed unless he is a perfect gentleman and only outranks the pups) or their submission display? One form of showing submission is to urinate. Also look at exact locations of urination. Are they urinating close to laundry? bathroom? bedrooms? Our personal scents can cause urination--sometimes the smell of our hormones will trigger them to mark the same location because it is instinct to "greet" other dogs in this manner. Other times their dominance over certain members of the family will trigger marking on or around items that smell like the person. Dog behavior is so closely tied to pack position that most of the things I mentioned above can be remedied when they find their happy position at the bottom; however--and this is a pretty big however, they will only be happy at the bottom if all the members of the family are calm and assertive, not agressive, volitile, angry, scared, nervous, etc. Then your urination problems will compound out of fear. It is very important to separate everyone's emotions from training the pups. If you make it as matter-of-fact as possible and follow-through with expectations, they should fall right into line. If you get upset at all when the urinate in the house, they often will associate your displeasure with urination rather than the location of the urination. This will cause them to want to hide or be unseen when they urinate. BTW, thanks for posting their sex and that they are spayed. Interference of their own hormones is one of the hardest factors to get past....glad you at least have that going for you!
Thank you all for the responses. I do think the couch thing was them saying "hey this is mine". I have never put them on a leash so I guess I need to try that. They are 8pounds each and it is easy to just say "come on let's go out" and they follow, much easier than if they were large dogs. I think we will implement the leash today. My older dd is home from ps early everyday this week and can help. The food thing we do. This may sound gross but sometimes I spit in their food. Someone once told me that the dominant dogs eat first so there would be their saliva in the food when the others eat. It worked years ago with my large dog so I try it now with the little ones. Brooke - what is funny is that they are so small they can't even get on the bed. They sure try though and it's funny to watch. lol! I'm trying to think back and see what changed in our home when they began to regress but I can't think of anything other than maybe I just relaxed on them a bit. I don't think the peeing is related to our large male dog. They don't do it around him at all. He is very friendly to them and even though there is a huge size difference they all get along and play together nicely. Gunner (large dog) knows his place in our family and knows that the humans rule. I wish he could tell that to the littles! Mostly they pee in the game room for whatever reason and that is now off limits to them. They will try to get in there just to pee. Now here lately it's been by the front door, middle of the hallway, by the fireplace, on the couch. It suddenly seems they dont' care they will just go anywhere.
I didn't read all the responses but one thing that worked well for our Lucy is when we'd give her a treat as soon as she'd go potty outside. We'd take treats outside with us and everytime she'd go potty we would immediately reward her (much like a child). I know it's frustrating. Our Lucy was that way and it took awhile for her to 'get it', but she did eventually become fully trained. Sadly, soon after, we lost her. Hope this subsides soon...it's so agonizing, I know.
I am an RVT (veterinary technician) and have to say that this is a common problem. Simply put the dogs need re trained. You have to start at the very beginning like they are brand new to your home. Go back to basics. Go back to crate training. Take them out often, very often, when you get up, after eating, every 2 hours if they aren't in their crate.- make a huge deal when they do go in the designated spots. If you want you can treat too, but just be consistent. I have to say though that as a side note - humans and dogs don't have a 'pack relationship' this isn't a dominance issue, it is purely a training issue. There are flaws in the theory that was done in the 1940's but it has been caught up and stated over and over so many believe it- but that is a side issue, bottom line they need retrained.
As a professional trainer and vet tech myself, I beg to differ. They are hard wired in how they relate to anything and anyone. Just as we process things in our human way, they process through a dog way and we call that dog-to-dog relationship a pack, just like as humans we are called a family. I'm curious what research has stated what my field studies seem to disprove.
I'll address the question -- it takes this topic away from the OP - and I stand by my comments that is indeed a training issue. Debunking The Dominance Theory is something actually that Julie Shaw, RVT VTS(Behavior), KPA CTP from Purdue University has been trying to get the word out at her speaking engagements for continued Veterinary education seminars. She has said in her speeches that she used believe the whole pack relationship theory and would advise her clients to seek dominance over their dogs. In her seminars she shows clips after clips of aggressive dogs - where things went wrong and how to advert these types of behaviors. She is working hard to get the word out on how to retrain owners and people on treating aggression. She talks about how the theory from the 1940's is flawed - I have an article that you can read. PUPPIES GONE WRONG: THE ROLE THE DOMINANCE THEORY PLAYED IN THEIR DEMISE I realize that this owner is dealing with house training issues and not aggressive behavior, but I read over and over the 'dominance theory' being stated and that simply isn't true it is all about training. Bottom line- the owner needs to go back to basics and re train the dog. I had to do it with one of my twins while potty training them, is it frustrating - yes--- but it worked out. It just takes time and patience.
I agree with the retraining no matter what I believe about pack mentality. It is obvious there is an issue here and they need to be retrained. I don't know what went wrong or why they regressed but they did. So back to square one I go! I do actually believe in the pack mentality. Ya know what? I need that Ceasar guy to come to my house. The dog whisperer or whatever. I love him! He is always talking about pack mentality and how the family as a whole (dogs and humans) are a pack and how the human needs to be the pack leader.
Sorry, I didn't mean to take away from you, MonkeyMamma. All of my probing earlier was intended to narrow down the possible causes, some being hormone related, others being pack-member response related, and others being a matter of habits not yet being formed. I tend to use their prewired response systems to elicite the behaviors I desire. I am actually considered a behaviorist as opposed to a trainer. (although we have dogs who have competed in obedience competitions) Trainers concentrate on achieving a specific response to a specific stimuli. Behaviorists concentrate on changing the way the dog responds to a specific stimuli. All that to say that if you are pleased as punch with all other aspects of your pups, then by all means find what motivates them and reward them every time they potty when and where you want them to. I am just one of those people who thinks they need to have a completed case study in front of them to assess the entire psyche of the dog. :roll: Sorry if I overcomplicated the matter.
Once again, my post has disappeared. I had posted much of what MamaKitty said - I would go back to crate training - but one crate for each puppy. The other thing I had suggested was that you have each boy take charge of his own puppy - feeding them, picking up after them, taking them "potty" as much as is possible for their ages so that each puppy bonds with his own "human". You will need to take them outside every two hours if possible, stretching it out as they learn not to go in their crates to about every four hours at their age. By a year they will probably be able to "hold" it for eight hours. I had suggested you keep them confined to a room that is easy to clean but where they will still feel like part of the family. A lot of people use the child gates - they are cheap, but be sure the pups cannot get their heads caught in them. When you take them outside be sure to take them to the same spot every time. They like to smell a lot, so be sure your boys give them plenty of time to sniff around. I have one dog that sniffs for several minutes before she'll "go". But by taking them to the same spot every time they will learn that that is what they are expected to "do" there. Training two at once is quite a challenge. I tried it once and swore I'd never do it again! In all honesty, training one puppy is a lot of work. Training two is at least twice as much! But they WILL learn. You just have to be consistent and not give up on them. Give them a LOT of praise when they do it right. God Bless and good luck!
I too am a tech (14yrs now) and was going to post pretty much all that. If it is just one dog I would rule out UTI as well (easily done with a routine urinalysis).
I loved his show....but have seen too many cruel videos with him and have decided there are many, many better ways than using aggression to gain control of your dog. I've seen BarkBusters work....in minutes http://www.barkbusters.ca/
