Did you know this about Common Core?

Discussion in 'Homeschooling' started by Lindina, Sep 4, 2013.

  1. Lindina

    Lindina Active Member

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  3. vantage

    vantage Active Member

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    Times are getting interesting to be sure.
     
  4. OpenMinded

    OpenMinded Member

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    This isn't totally true. We are in a charter school that does have to adhere to common core standards now. They are not changing their curriculum and are not word for word going through anything. Our books for our 7th grader this year are the same as they were for my 7th grader last year. We use Study Island to meet common core standards.
    I visited our local schools just a week ago and while it has changed some textbooks...it does not look much different than the books my children used while attending years ago. There is a lot more writing involved in common core.
    I am not saying particular schools aren't taking it to an extreme and telling their teachers to verbatim follow things, but they aren't required to verbatim follow things. Teachers created a ton of common core materials last year to adapt their current curriculum.
    I guess coming from a poor state with low rating academics and seeing the huge gaps between the good schools and the poor schools...I think a common ground is a good thing for these students who are in these schools.
    I also think coming from a lax state with regards to home school requirements that it may be a good thing for home schoolers. We have belonged to so many homeschool groups here where there were kids whose parents had just not done anything with them academics wise. I know that is probably going to go over badly on this site, but I do feel for these kids that get pulled, wind up 2-3 grade levels behind their peers b/c their parents are just joining groups and don't have to test or prove anything, and then they either get thrown back into public school and are put grade levels below or they are homeschool graduated and work flipping burgers.
    It is very sad. I was proud of homeschooling for so long b/c the kids are getting a great education and we are enjoying each other, but the norm for around here is that most (75%+) homeschoolers just aren't doing anything and saying just being home is better than the public school.
     
  5. Lindina

    Lindina Active Member

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    One of the things about CC that bothers me the most is that they're teaching (supposed to teach) kids how to use manipulative language to play on people's emotions to get them to support something the kids want. Not to give valid reasons for it, but to propagandize.

    I don't like it that they're limiting the reading of literature, doesn't matter what they're replacing it with.

    They're already not teaching kids math here in the public schools. When I first started teaching OPKs, 14 years ago, I could count on kids coming out of public to be on level in EITHER math or reading/la, and about one level below on the other. The last 3 kids I enrolled, not counting my SN 4th grader this year, had passed all their classes and the state tests in 7th and 8th grades. Last year I had to put the 8gg into 6th grade math and 5th grade reading, and the 9gb into 4th grade math and 5th grade reading, and both into 5th grade English. Ordinary, regular, not SN kids. My current 10th grader came for 8th grade, and fortunately she could read and do English, but I also had to start her in 4th grade math. We've got her about up to pre-algebra now, hoping to get her far enough by graduation to get into college (4-year, not 2-year).

    I agree with you that there are way too many kids who are just "home" but not "home-schooled". I knew a few, years ago, and a few more a bit more recently. But most of the homeschoolers I have personal acquaintance with are in it for the best for their kids, and are doing a good job. Obviously, some do a better job than others. But I am violently opposed to the government telling homeschoolers WHAT they have to teach their children and HOW it's to be taught! That's why we homeschool!

    I am also of the opinion that if you have an education worthy of the name, you'll be able to pass whatever kind of test they throw at you, as long as it's actually academically based, not attitude based.

    This is the same old Outcome-Based Education, but on steroids.
     
  6. OpenMinded

    OpenMinded Member

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    It probably came out poorly in my other post...I am not wanting the govt. to tell homeschoolers what exactly to teach, but I do think that it is sad when a 5th grader who has no special needs can't read, write, spell, or do math. It is what it is and I do know a lot that do a great job. I just know of quite a few in our particular area that are just not doing anything. And b/c it is so lax here no one knows that they aren't doing anything until it is too late. :(
    I think I am sensitive about common core b/c we do utilize a charter school that has to make sure they cover the common core standards. Some of that is certain topics in certain grades, but our curricula for now hasn't changed. They just added Study Island and special class connects to hit certain topics that the regular k12 curricula doesn't cover during those grade levels.
    I don't have a high schooler yet although my 8th grader is taking 9th grade English and I just haven't seen common core be what everyone is making it out to be...yet...
    I do think certain standards in certain grades should be common sense though. People should realize if your 4th grader still has trouble with reading or writing to seek help. I do think kids get pushed through the system that have IEP's or 504's. It is one of the reasons my dysgraphic/dyslexic son won't ever go back to brick and mortar school. I think they would just push him through and not make him work for his grades.
    I just haven't seen common core turn our charter school into something that I would be nervous about and it hasn't become what these articles are talking about either. Whether that remains to be the case in the future, I do not know.
     
  7. MagnoliaHoney

    MagnoliaHoney New Member

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    I don't do K12, because I think it is entirely too much time on the PC. But, we do school every day. And my children are learning and are at least on target if not above (almost every one who meets my children say they have very large vocabularies.)

    I am not sure what state you are in, but where I am at, I have not met any one who doesn't take their homeschooling of their children seriously. All the children I have met, the parents are very proactive in trying to teach and educate their children.
     
  8. sixcloar

    sixcloar New Member

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    Common Core scares me for so many more reasons than just the academics, though I read an article this morning that said students in NY and KY, where CC had already implemented, tested 30% lower than the previous year.

    As for homeschoolers who don't do anything... They are out there. All of us know that. I've homeschooled in three states-one that required nothing, one moderately regulated, and currently low regulated. I have only known one family that did nothing (well, almost nothing). I actually encouraged them to at least use K12. Most of us are in it to give our child the best education we can.
     
  9. Lindina

    Lindina Active Member

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    "Standards" is what all that NCLB has been about all this time! There ARE standards, and what-you're-supposed-to-know-when. Most of us are actually exceeding them, I would say, and the academics part doesn't really scare me because I'm going to keep on doing what I'm doing. It's all that detritus about the propagandizing, and all the spy stuff about keeping track of every kid, who they associate with, what religion if any their parents are, what their parents' political views are, and all this that will be available to employers in the future, and the whole Communist thing. They don't call it that, but what else is it? It's certainly not about "education" or getting the US "caught up to" other countries in international tests of academics! It's about control.

    Next thing, they'll be putting kids on career tracks in junior high. They're already doing it in high schools.

    And as for the people who give homeschoolers a bad name, if they're not doing anything for their kids, they're just not going to do it, no matter what the government regulations say. They've learned how to work the system and make paper-compliance a way of life.
     
  10. Jackie

    Jackie Active Member

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    Openminded, just give it time. As you "get use" to the easy changes, they will gradually add more and more. Common Core is about creating autotrons, trained monkeys that can do the same thing over and over, but not about educating. It's about mind control, not about teaching one to think for himself.
     
  11. *Angie*

    *Angie* Member

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    In a case like that, where the children really just aren't being educated at all, I think the family should be reported to the proper authorities, just like they should be if they were abusing or neglecting their physical or emotional needs.
     
  12. Cornish Steve

    Cornish Steve Active Member

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    But isn't that a right that we homeschooling parents claim? If we don't believe a subject is valuable, we're free to drop it. Yes, there are implications when going to college, and so on, but we demand the freedom to choose what should and should not be taught. I know some parents who have not forced their children to read until much much later than I would have thought, but so be it.

    Now, I don't agree that the federal government should be able to demand a common core - if anything, it's a power of the states - but it's always going to be true that we'll disagree sometimes with their decisions on curriculum. That's a common reason for homeschooling.
     
  13. Jackie

    Jackie Active Member

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    I agree with Steve.
     
  14. Cornish Steve

    Cornish Steve Active Member

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    Not a bad thing, actually. One (but not the only, of course) reason for education is to be prepared for a job. It scares me how little link-up there is today between the education system and the needs of job-seekers - hence the huge number of students/graduates who struggle to find a job. Take communication, for example, which is essential in almost any business. Why are students not taught business communication skills, how to write emails, how to record answering messages and answer a phone, how to work as part of a team, how to plan and conduct meetings, how to run a conference call, how to interview people? It's embarrassing to see how ill-prepared new grads are for these things. Maybe linking education to careers earlier would help to resolve that basic disconnect.
     
  15. MagnoliaHoney

    MagnoliaHoney New Member

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    Now I did go to a PS high school, it was alternative. And if you took the right courses you did learn those things. (well not email, because there was not wide spread email yet-most people didn't have a PC, nor a cell phone-cells phones did NOT have email yet, and they were only people like drs who had them any way! lol).

    But, I took some course, I can't remember the name of it, but it taught us to fill out a job application, how to interview for a job, how to budget our money, it was some kind of life skills class.

    Then I also took entrepreneurship. We were given grants to actually make and run our own business. We learned how to run a business how to write a business plan, and at the end of the course you went before a grant funding board (a local oil company here who was granting the money for this course), and you presented your business plan to them. The winner received a larger grant to start their business. Ok here was how it went, at the beginning of the course you were to start a small business (sell candy, make up, what ever) they gave every one in the course 50 dollars as start up money. Plus a bank account was given to us (it only had 10 dollars in the bank account though). During the time of the course you were learning how to write a business plan, read wall street journal keep up with stocks (which you were also given real stocks, which I still own). During the course you were gradually learning how to run a business, and how to research a business, and interviewing local business owners. Then at the end was when you did your presentation to the grant board. The winner of that for each school, received a 500 dollar grant. After that, there was a second round where the winner for the state received 2,500 grant, and then a third round for national won 5,000 dollar grant. (I won national).

    Any way....it basically taught you every thing you need to know about business. I no longer own my own business, but I do know the ins and outs of one enough to know what I am doing when I am shopping now! It has served me well through out life that one semester course! I highly recommend it to any one. It was started in NYC to help keep at risk kids from crime, but I took the course in Kansas. And it was great.
     
  16. Jackie

    Jackie Active Member

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    I actually took this in what was suppose to be a "government" class. We did researching different jobs we might be going into (including a skills inventory), interviewing, budgeting, mock marriage, stock market. Part of the year was dealing with prejudices, and that's all I can remember. What I DO know is that we never did learn anything about government, lol!
     
  17. Actressdancer

    Actressdancer New Member

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    My high school only taught those things in a "remedial" class called "life skills." If you were on track academically, you weren't allowed to take it.
     
  18. OpenMinded

    OpenMinded Member

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    I think it really depends on why you homeschool. I know many have friends that are teachers or spouses that are teachers, but some of the stuff being condemned by those opposing common core is from a religious point of view. I do think most of the topics I have seen do compel you to think and explore your point of view. A lot of homeschoolers do not wish their students to learn of certain things at all and I think with tests evolving for common core there will be more topics that are hot button topics for the middle/high school age level. I just don't see it as much different from topics when I did go to a public high school eons ago.
    I think most of the things that everyone complains from common core has been taken out of context and made to fit a particular point of view. I disagree on a lot of points about homeschooling choices mainly b/c I have had the experience of going from one state to another and realizing that my kids were at a disadvantage b/c I had followed the theory that I could choose what we learned and on my time table only to spend several months in a different state due to a family illness. Once we were there 30 days, we were subject to that state's rules and guidelines for homeschoolers and it was strict. We had to turn in hours and attendance to the district as well as outline our curricula and goals and finally test or be evaluated and they were serious about it all. It was all based on that state's standards which compared to my lax state with no rules for homeschoolers...we were in serious trouble.
    I think having common laws concerning things does help families that move a lot and that would suddenly be subjected to a stricter state's laws. Think military families here. All of the military families that I know take homeschooling very serious and keep immaculate records b/c they never know what state and what rules they will fall under next move.
    Part of the reason we chose a charter that uses a national curriculum was in case my mom's cancer returns and we have to go back to my home state. I don't want to get caught with my pants down again to the detriment of my kids. I am just saying I have been put in a spot where if I would have been following common guidelines for all states that we wouldn't have had such a rough time jumping into a state with stricter guidelines. I think it is a very real problem in the school system when children move from state to state and if you move a lot that it could become a problem in your private homeschooling.
    I think though for the most part I don't see the need to condemn common core yet as everything that I have read with articles and actual links to materials or stories aren't things that I oppose my children thinking about critically or them reading on topics such as abortion or morality issues or how things can be manipulated to be one side or the other. It just seems every time I go online lately someone is posting about common core in the homeschool world but most homeschoolers have not truly been exposed to common core or looked through textbooks written to the common core. That is all I am saying. I do have a stake in it b/c my kids are in a charter school and do fall under common core. I have read a lot about it. I met with our local school and teachers. We have relatives that are teachers and I have looked through materials. Granted I do not have high school material available aside from the 9th grade materials my daughter is currently using...so I can't weigh in much there. The stuff I have seen though is not remarkably any more controversial or emotionally swaying her point of view than materials that I was taught with 20 years ago.
     
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2013
  19. Jackie

    Jackie Active Member

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    I think the best solution to that, then, would be if ALL states would give homeschoolers the flexibility they need, instead of some states being inflexible and demanding us to follow their failing methods.
     
  20. mommix3

    mommix3 Active Member

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    To have a curriculum that adheres to the same scope and sequence can be a good thing.. I remember moving from one state to another and what we were learning at the new school was different from old one.. I had a hard time "catching up" because the new school was much more advanced.. I don't know what the big deal is really.. I'm not for it or against it.. Just like anything, I think there's good and bad.. It sure would keep me on my toes and even help me with my homeschooling if I knew a basic core of what was taught in our school here in each grade.. Especially since my kids are going back into public school..

    Just like OpenMinded said, I see parents all the time who don't educate their children and hide behind the title of "homeschooler".. It annoys the CRUD out of me.. I know a lady who has 6 kids and her husband wanted her to homeschool even though she didn't want to.. She didn't put any effort into it and her son is 10 now and can hardly read at all.. She said she just didn't have time to teach them.. IF she did "teach" them, it was putting them at the table with a book and yelling at them to do their work with no instruction.. 3 of them went back to school this year.. I haven't talked to this lady in over a year, but I wonder if she got them caught up before they went back.. It is educational neglect and I agree, it should be reported..
     
  21. sixcloar

    sixcloar New Member

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    We are not military but my dh's organization uses a contract system based on the military's. For us, that can mean a lot of moves. I have lived in states from moderate to no regulations. I keep records, because I know our lifestyle demands it. I keep attendance records even when I'm not required to do so. I have portfolios of each child's work for each year. I have standardized test scores from the one year we had to test. I know that I have to keep on my toes, because that it what our frequent moves require. But, even if I had not kept all those things, I think I could put together attendance records and a portfolio of work without much stress.
    This would be the answer to the problem!

    I believe that it is fine to learn things differently and on a different timeline than the public school system. I am not going to question anyone's methods. I have met very unstructured homeschoolers with extremely intelligent kids. I have met strict school-at-home families whose kids seem to struggle and vice versa. If we agree that all children, even those who are homeschooled, should follow Common Core, we are taking away our freedom to teach as it fits our families. Every child is not ready to learn XYZ at age 5, 8, or 10.

    Again, I don't like the idea of a national set of standards that takes away teachers' creativity and students' ability to THINK, but Common Core is so much more than a set of educational standards. A national database is scary--especially one that includes religious preferences as well a political affiliation.
     

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