I often read teacher's message boards, for new ideas to use in our homeschool. The "A to Z Teaching" link at the top of this board is awesome...you should check it out if you haven't. Anyway, I was reading the fifth grade board over there because my oldest is heading into 5th, and that's uncharted territory for me! :lol: I opened the thread about what to do the first week, and read these comments: ~"I think that the first few weeks of school is all about procedures/routines/rules etc. I typically spend 6 weeks on this stuff." ~"After finishing my first year in 5th grade, I have learned that this following year I will spend MUCH more time on procedures, routines, and rules. I would not recommend jumping into the curriculum until you have thoroughly established these things." ~"I normally do procedures/routines with a few get to know you activities thrown in to break up the monotony. It's also key to model EVERYTHING. Don't take for granted that 5th graders know how to line up etc." ~"I usually spend the first week doing community building activities, getting to know you games, and we spend TONS of time on procedures and rules." Now, I'm not knocking the teachers. I taught art in a private school for a year, and I understand how necessary it is to have good classroom management. However, I didn't realize it could take SIX weeks to instill this kind of stuff in a fifth grade classroom?! (Other teachers do chime in and say that they don't devote anywhere near that much time to rules, etc. before delving into the curriculum.) I'm just sharing that because reading it has given me a whole different perspective on the efficiency of homeschooling....and on my state's mandatory rule that we devote 4.5 hours to academics each day. At home, we don't really have to waste any time on rules and procedures because the kids already know them.
I used to be my son's aid when he was in public school (he's autistic and they had mainstreamed him) and I can say that I've seen these things quite often. It was a normal occurence to see a class walking back to their class, just to start walking back down the hall. All because someone had talked in line or... oh my stepped out of the line. Which of course caused them to be late getting to go out for reccess or go to lunch. I don't know how many times I saw kids just barely sitting down to eat their lunch and the bell would ring and they were told to throw their lunch away because lunch was now over.
I can say I am floored right along with you. I mean I understand needing to make things clear but geeze thats nuts.
SIX WEEKS to learn how to stand in line? Oh! They will never get my kids.... My kids will consider hiring their kids one day, maybe.... Because there is no way those guys could be leaders...
But necessary! If you are "mean" in the beginning, you can back off and be "nicer" once they know you mean business. But if you start "nice" and it doesn't work, it's almost impossible to tighten the reigns. I agree that by 5th grade the kids should have the routine established, but also by 5th grade they're becoming more defiant.
Now, now, ladies! Don't be so harsh! Think of all the wonderfully perfect little cogs-in-the-machine they are producing! And think of the wonderful self-esteem building experienced by the smug little goodie-two-shoes who relish being the teacher's pet by pointing out the others who are not conforming as they should! God HELP America!
Wow, I never realised that either! IN fifth grade we had a new room ( why do I remember all this in detail? I have no idea!) We were in a big room split by those moveable bendable walls and three classes were in the same big space. Mr Truscott was my teacher and I remember he was big on drawing and art. lol! I can visualise my picture on the wall, is that weird? But, I do not recall any rules or regulations other than if one student was waiting to talk to the teacher at his desk, you waited quietly while he helped the first student.
The best teachers Kevin had were the ones who were clear and stood by their rules. Their classrooms were the quietest and they were the friendliest teachers on the teams each year.
Go back and get them to explain why it takes so long to get settled. I go over there all the time for advice, and they nursed me through all three years so far. They are all nice ladies..and men.. over there. I personally think it's like comparing apples to oranges here. They must have cooperation in a school, and if you have just one defiant kid, that can mess a class up. A defiant kid can also mess up a home school as well, though!:wink:
Okay- I've been cheated.:evil: I once had a teacher call me a tattletale, when I told her something someone was doing. And to think I was trying to help her out! No esteem building for me!
When I was a classroom teacher, I almost always taught a combined 1st/2nd grade class. I never spent more than a week on procedures/etc for a couple of reasons. 1) My 2nd graders had already been with me for a year and knew the rules. They quickly taught the first graders. (Hmmm, almost like a family would?) 2)If I didn't get started quickly into academics, the kids were almost shocked when the "real" work began. Then it was like starting at square one again. 3)Building community was a year-long event, not something just to be accomplished in September. As for making everyone start over if the line wasn't straight or someone talked - forget about it. I needed my lunch break as much as they did!
I think you're right. It's the nature of the beast, and doesn't reflect on the teachers. It should also free us from worrying about how much we actually acomplish. Since we DON'T spend 5-6 weeks setting down the rules, dealing with behavior, etc., we shouldn't get all worried about how "little" time we spend actually teaching. Our kids accomplish more learning in less time; we do NOT have to fill every breathing second with "quality academics" because of what we think is/isn't being done in a "real" school.
Well, the only thing that came to mind was this saying I found some time ago. It just always seems to sum it all up for me: Your system is perfectly designed to yield the results you are getting.
I am sure it is difficult to set up procedures and routines for a bunch of 5th graders. Fifth graders are not a flexible or easily adaptable as kids in younger grades. I think 6 weeks is a bit long however. I am not sure what to think.....other than homeschooling I have only taught VBS, AWANA and Sunday School. Establishing a routine didn't seem to take that long and I only had the kids an hour a week. But then again...an hour a week is cake compared to 6 hours a day. Maybe it does take that long depending on the type of class you have. I don't agree with focusing ONLY on routine and not doing any real work though.
OMGosh...I so agree with you. When I taught 1st I remember spending time reminding them where stuff was & going over rules & what not. But I don't remember it being over a weeks. I mean they were just as excited to be back & see their friends. I would say after the first couple of days it was just a reminder (pretty much like every day for the first little while) of what is expected & what not. Of course I was a lot more leinant with mine than the other teacher. I didn't mind a dull roar in the classroom as long as their work was getting done.
I had a principal who wanted us to all post our Classroom Rules where everyone could see them. I REALLY didn't like that; in my mind, the kids should KNOW that they're not alowed to hit, etc. So I wrote them as to what I expected them TO DO, not what I DIDN'T want them doing! "Listen when someone is talking" "Show respect to everyone" "Do your best work". But I also only had about five kids, because it was a special needs class. I didn't have the behavior problems the "regular" teachers had.
I don't think I had my posted any where. I didn't shove any rules down their throat either. I asked on the first day what do you think are some rules & things we need to know about behaving in school. I had more rules from the kids than I ever imagined. It was a great way to build trust & getting to know each other. I think every child gave me an answer...about 20 or so rules.
