Crystal, Thank you for sharing. Although we disagree I appreciate hearing your side and understand all the heartache and emotion that goes into all of these situations. Again thank you. It occurs to me often, and I'm sure to offend people here, but how many tragic situations (not all of them of course, but a lot) could be avoided if we could only wait for marriage to procreate. I believe that sex outside of marriage is a sin and how many sad situations spring from violating that. Unwanted pregnancies, families torn apart, sexually transmitted diseases, ect. Sometimes it's hard to look at the world and see all the pain. Sometimes it's hard to look inside my own family and see the pain. But I know that God's way will lead me to happiness.
I do not believe in having the government invovled in our day to day lives. I do believe that government should out law abortions. I have heard the argument a million times that a woman's body is her own but what about the body of that child? Does the child get any say in this, no because it is dependent on that Mother. There are states that will press murder charges if a pregnant woman is beaten and then looses the baby but will then allow that woman to have an abortion. The logic is not there. Except in cases of rape, (incest and molestation are rape in my book) which I a girl/woman should have extenous counsling for any how, the girl/woman had a choice. They chose to have sex that was their choice. If a pregnancy results then that is a consequence that they must deal with (which is why abstaining till married is the best choice but not an easy one). What is it with society that says hey we can just get rid of the consequences of our actions. Now maybe that girl/woman is not ready or wants to be a Mom well then that is where adoption comes in. There are many families who are willing to adopt or there is always the father or his family who might want to raise the child. I will always be pro-life, anti abortion or however you want to say. I use my vote to reflect this also.
maybe should be softer spoken on one hand everything i posted is still true. no i dont believe in abortion even with rape or incest. the only time i believe that it is even a cosideration is if the mothers life is in jepardy, i mean she is going to die, not be emotionally tramatized. i mean physically in jepardy( i know thats not spelled right, but just cant picture it) and if my daughter were to ever be raped at 10, i can honestly say that abortion would never be an option. i dont know what we would do, but never abortion. I am sorry for your loss. i believe we are to hate the sin not the sinner. i also believe that if we could prevent all these unwanted pregnancies, than we wouldnt have this problem in the first place. i also can honestly say that if i had been there when you walked into the clinic i would have gladly wrapped my arms around you and taken you home i have always believed that we are responsible for helping those in need. that is why i volunteer at the crisis pregnancy center. how else are these girls supposed to get through these times? we cant condem abortion but not support the girls who choose life. all of us have sinned and in Gods eyes a sin is a sin. my deepest apology for seeming so hard about this topic. i do feel for the girls in this position and i was being brutally honest about the unborn being a life. still feel that way. as for your relative and the child given up for adoption, my heart breaks for her and i in no way condone the way her parents treated her, but for that childs sake i am glad she gave him life. maybe she could fight for a right to visitation. if a judge knew how it all happened i would think he would take her side. so again please forgive me for not being more soft hearted about this touchy subject. i have seen videos of abortions taking place and it just goes straight to the core of all i believe in to defend those babies,i can understand though you not walking in my shoes and seeing all that i have seen, not feeling the way i feel. i will try to behave myself more mannerly in the future.
Crystal, I do thank you for sharing where you are coming from. You certainly have a right to voice your opinion. I do not agree with you, though. Abortion is not a gray area for me. I am never for it-not in cases of rape/incest, not in cases of the mother's life being in danger. Just like you said, murder is murder. I believe that God is the giver of life, and only He has the authority to take life away. That's all I'm saying on the issue, just wanted to clear up that it is not a gray area for us all.
To this day I am baffled by this. It makes absolutely no sense.:? I believe abortion is murder. I do not belive anybody has a right to murder whether the life is in or outside the body. No, I do not believe that my vote for somebody who is pro-life will make a difference but I can at least rest knowing that I didn't vote for a person whose beliefs are contrary to what God says is right. Plus, I do not think it is enough for me to say that the government doesn't have a right to tell women what to do with their bodies. I think what we need to take into account is what God says we should do with our bodies. After all when we all stand before God, and we will, are we going to be accountable to the government or to HIM?
We have already blurred the lines when hospitals allow a child born alive in a botched abortion to be ignored until it dies. NO ONE is saying this child isn't a child, or calling it a "fetus" to avoid the reality of the life. We blur the lines when we allow the baby to be born except for its head, and then puncture its brain with a pair of scissors. This child who is only seconds from "live" birth. What's the difference between that and allowing a young teen who delivers in secret, and then decides to throw her newborn in a trash can? Is she REALLY doing anything different? What if the baby's a week old, and the mom decides she can't handle it after all? Wouldn't the sensible thing be to just allow the infant to die, rather than to condemn it to a life of possible abuse with a mom who resents it and won't love it? We ALWAYS have a choice. A choice to sin or not to sin, and a choice to accept God's grace or not. The crisis pregnancy centers in my area are there to help. They will assist teens who are kicked out of their homes because of chosing to keep the baby. They are there to provide physical assistance, financial assistance, clothing, housing, counseling. They provide post-abortion couseling for any victims of abortion (and I DO mean "victims") that might need/want it. They are in there for the LONG HAUL. Unlike abortion providers who takes the kid out, throws it in a trashcan, and send you home with an asprin. I also don't consider it a gray area.
Thank you all. I can't say that I truly understand why abortion enters into the politcal realm, but I can now see where some of you stand anyway. Crystal - thanks so much. Very powerful indeed. I can't imagine living with that pain.
People In China are determined to kill their new born female children. (Given the "one child only" rule and the deep desire to have a male child) Should their not be a law against that? Dead is dead, and it is not THEIR body they are killing. Just because they are going to do it anyway, is never a reason to let it go. Not with my kids desire to smoke or drink, and not with those who choose their lifestyle over someone elses' right to live.
JenniferErix just wanted to say i love your mother teresa quote. very to the point. Also to the others who have read my prior posts i am again sorry if i hurt anyones feelings. i really did not mean to do that, i just get tired of hearing the same old argument for abortion when medicine has come such a long way and now we have no excuse not to know that that is a baby, a human life. :cry::cry::?:?:
Nancy - IMO the main reason abortion enters the political realm is exactly for what you see....it divides people. That being said, I just would like to thank each and everyone of you for all you said and discussed. Crystal (((((((hugs)))))))) and alot of credit for you standing up and explaining. I, personally, saw a movie when I was a teen that showed footage of exactly what happens in different abortions. That is something I will never forget. I truely believe life begins at conception. Same as homeschooling in a sense......it's not my place to judge others. Too big of a plank in my eye I gotta worry about.
As I often do at this Spot, I found myself nodding in agreement numerous times as I was reading. I, too, applaud each poster for courage in speaking to an emotionally-laden issue. Cystal, what happened to you is inexcusable. I am shocked that a supposed "pro-life" person would neither offer her home nor point you to other resources. Without compassion, words become like "clanging cymbals." On behalf of all those who believe that each person is made in the image of God, I apologize. I am so sorry you and your dear mother have had to go through these things! Surely the heart of God was grieved. *weeping for the things that are not right in this world and praying that the great power of Jesus' Love will heal every wound...*
I don't "vote" either way on this issue. Abortions are going to happen one way or another no matter what. It's none of my business who gets an abortion or who doesn't. It's nobody's business if I decide to have one or not. I don't think the govt should be involved in it at all & nobody should 'benefit' from it -- either way -- but they are. This is just one of those never-ended things. It'll never be resolved.
I have to agree with you, that is true no matter what we say or do it's still going to happen. We are not in those ladies shoe when they are doing it so I will not respond too it. Until you been in there shoes you don't know why or what is going on. there is only one person they have to answer too, and it's not any of us.
Looking at the original question, why it enters the political arena... It could be the definition of when human life begins. Those who believe it begins at conception would claim the same rights of "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" for the unborn as for the born. Many people enter the "debate" for personal, religious, philosophical, or moral reasons, but in some sense it also fits the definition of a civil-rights issue. Does that make sense, Nancy?
All I know is I dont believe in abortion myself but I dont think we have that right to throw stones at anyone else its between God and them. Thats something they will have to deal with at the perly gates. The planned Parent hood helped me when I was younger not to have an abortion but to get me on the pill to regulate my body which was all messed up when I was younger I was in horrible pain, and to teach me to be safe if I was active. I am very thankful for them when no one else would help me with this they did. I was dirt poor back then too. I thank the Gov for funding them. They do more then just abortions, if you dont want the Gov funding them I would ask you to go vist them to find out, NOT just read what they do on the internet or what a news reporter says. Find out yourself. When I was there they didnt even mention abortion. My niece was raped at 12yrs she got pregnant if she would have had the baby there was an 80% chance she could have died because her body was not developed yet. It was her choice she had the abortion. No I dont believe in abortion myself especially when they think its just convient for them to do just do it because they were stupid in the first place not taking care, but I would have went with her with a shotgun if anyone tried to stop her at the clinic door. Her CHOICE As for the law on this I would say I lean towards Pro Choice unless they put certain things on "Prolife" such as NO abortion only under certain circumstances like rape, incest and molestation, doing harm to the persons body like in the case of my niece. I agree with the others though up there that they will find a way if the law is overturned to do it especially a frightened teenagers from a small towns where I used to come from where information is not readily available. Sam
Good points, Sam. Though I'm not at the same place in my thinking, I see your reasoning. I came back on to add that civil rights are not always neatly defined. For example, prisoners are one group who have their rights limited. Similarly, the rights of the mother in regards to health ( ie. life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness) are compared to the rights of the unborn baby. Where the appropriate line can be drawn is the point where debate begins. Again, that's where law and, therefore, politics enter. (Just thought that might speak to the original question, but I'm not sure it's helpful to the general direction this thread has taken. If not, I apologize.)
Honestly as much as I am against abortion I dont think I could look someone in the eye and go into their private affairs and tell them, I have the right to decide what you do with your body this is no longer a private thing between you and God, its what the majority thinks is right. I am not arguing above please....I am just saying How I feel what I couldnt do. I couldnt judge anyone else especially since I am not without sin myself. Did I say that right? You right where does the line stop? I am really going to pray on this, then make a decision and write my congressman on my decision. Its been on my mind a lot this week. I really hope they make the right decision too. I really want to thank everyone for their input it has opened a lot of windows for me with different views. I had written the above really fast this morning so wanted to add some more when I got back from Co-op. Sam
